Leah Remini: Scientology and the Aftermath (2016-19) (6) or
Are we being properly (mis)informed or not? (Review of TV show that ran 3 seasons. Hosts: Leah Remini and Mike Rinder)
At 0:44 screen dump text: “In 1986, David Miscavige announced the death of L. Ron Hubbard to Scientologists.”
At 1:30 Mike Rinder: “After the death of L. Ron Hubbard, Miscavige set about consolidating his power as the undisputed heir to Hubbard.”
At 1:41 screen dump text: “In 1992, David Miscavige appeared on television to defend his leadership, and publicly denounce other high ranking officials. [‘Nightline’ Feb 92]”
At 1:53 David Miscavige: “The one girl there that was complaining about it, a girl named Vicki Aznaran, this is a girl who was kicked out for trying to bring criminals into the church.”
At 2:10 ‘Nightline’ interviewer: “And you and she were, at one point, rivals for the leadership of the...”
At 2:14 David Miscavige: “Absolutely not.”
At 2:16 Mike Rinder: “He started removing from their positions anybody who was in the hierarchy and was a recognized figure in Scientology, starting with Mary Sue Hubbard. He subsequently got rid of Dede and Gale Reisdorf, Pat and Annie Broeker, and everybody connected to them and everybody that might've been allied to them.”
At 2:33:
The story of John “JB” Brousseau(Incl.: Mary Sue Hubbard; Dede and Gale Reisdorf; Pat and Annie Broeker)
At 5:32 screen dump text: “Scientologist 32 years, Gold Base, left in 2010”
At 5:27: “I'm John Brousseau, and I was a member of the Sea Organization, and I reported directly to David Miscavige. I was, like, 20 years old when I got introduced to Scientology.”
He left 2010 - 32 years in = joined 1978.
At 5:57 screen dump text: “Six months after joining Scientology, JB was recruited to work for L. Ron Hubbard at his secret ranch in La Quinta, California.”
At 6:38 screen dump text: “In the early 1980s, JB began working alongside David Miscavige.”
The story of the taking down of Mary Sue Hubbard, the Reisdorfs and the Broekers is told by John “JB” Brousseau at 6:50-13:58 that ends with that David Miscavige was now the Chairman of the Board of the Religious Technology Center (RTC). Some historical sequences:
Mary Sue Hubbard
At 7:25 Mike Rinder: “There was a pretty infamous meeting that happened between Miscavige and Mary Sue. Were you around for that?”
At 7:30 John “JB” Brousseau: “I was around for that in a very peculiar way. I put a wireless microphone on Miscavige, and they went into a hotel in L.A. to meet with Mary Sue and whatever entourage was with her. And I was sitting in the van with these giant reel-to-reel recorders, recording everything through these two microphones unbeknownst to Mary Sue. So that he could record this meeting with Mary Sue that was to argue her into submission, and basically, D.M. would take charge, and she would resign and step down.”
At 8:18 Leah Remini: “And did she put up a fight or...”
At 8:20 John “JB” Brousseau: “I heard some pretty vociferous objections coming out of her mouth. I can't really tell you what she was saying, but it was obviously directed at him. And some disagreement and name-calling happening, yeah.”
At 8:34 Leah Remini: “What happened to Mary Sue?”
At 8:35 John “JB” Brousseau: “Well, she went to prison, right, ultimately. And she just sort of ended up being put in a position of having really no say or power and quietly lived off her life until she died.”
At 8:52 screen dumps text: “In 1981, Mary Sue Hubbard resigned her post. Two years later, she served a year in prison after members of The Church were found guilty of conspiracy against the U.S. government. Upon release, she lived in isolation until her death in 2002.”
Dede and Gale Reisdorf
At 9:14 John “JB” Brousseau: “Dede and Gale Reisdorf, they were at one point in charge of the CMO*. They were the commanding officer and the deputy commanding officer, respectively. And one day, Gale came out and was telling me about how David Miscavige was threatening, and that she needed to go talk to Pat Broeker.”
At 10:10: “So she hopped in the car. So yeah, I drove off the base with her. And I went to the pay phone in San Bernardino, and I made my phone call and sent the page to Broeker's driver, and I was sitting there, waiting for a call. And maybe 20, 30 minutes went by, and this van pulls up with Miscavige and a bunch of other people.
They all pile out, ..., and someone jumped out with a tire iron, ..., and he proceeded to the best of his ability, destroy the phone ..., so that no phone call could be received there.
They basically severed the ability for Broeker to find out what's happening. Miscavige was gonna deal with this himself. And basically, they're in there with Gale, and it's Miscavige and Gale one on one. And he basically talks her into submission, and then Miscavige would ultimately take out Pat Broeker.”
Pat and Annie Broeker
At 11:20 David Miscavige at briefing 24 Jan 86: “When LRH left in 1980 to do his researches, he took with him his two most trusted friends and companions. These two people were Pat Broeker and Annie Broeker.”
At 11:37 Mike Rinder: “Pat and Annie Broeker had been around for many, many, many years on the Hubbard side of the equation. They were the most trusted people who would carry out Hubbard's wishes. And they were the only people that were with Hubbard in the last years of his life.
I'm curious, JB, what you know about how Pat Broeker eventually was moved away.”
At 12:10 John “JB” Brousseau: “Well, I was at the Creston Ranch. ...
And then all of the sudden one day, Miscavige shows up and it's, like, a raid. And I was there, and there was, I don't know, a dozen other people, the best of the best, pretty much picked by Broeker to run this ranch. Everyone gets corralled up, except me. ... Miscavige comes out after yelling and screaming with these guys, and he says, ‘You know what's happening with those guys, JB?’ And I'm like, ‘No’. He says, ‘They're all going to the f****** RPF’. But the end result was Pat Broeker somehow was brought to the agreement that he would just live a simple life and go off his merry way, having nothing to do with Scientology. Annie was convinced to divorce, disconnect, have nothing to do with Pat, which she did.”
Leah Remini shares an interesting observation that I also at the time reacted to:
At 13:58: “Anybody who's a Scientologist or grows up in Scientology, you get used to seeing the same people being brought up on stage at these very important events. Oh, that's Mike Rinder, Heber Jentzsch, Ray Mithoff, Guillaume Lesêvre. Like, these are very important people, and over time I noticed, just as a civilian Scientologist, at these events, where's Mike Rinder? Where's Heber Jentzsch? Where's... where are the people that we know, that we had been used to seeing? And then eventually it was just David Miscavige.”
It was spoken about among the Scientology public...
The story of Gary “Jackson” Morehead (jackson1)
At 23:01 screen dump text: “Leah and Mike are on their way to meet with Gary ‘Jackson’ Morehead, who reported directly to David Miscavige.”
At 23:29 screen dump text: “Scientologist for 30 years, Sea Org member, left in 1997”
At 23:24: “My name is Jackson Morehead. I worked for the Church of Scientology International, and I was the Security Chief at the International Base.”
At 23:41: “I followed my mom into the Sea Org back in 1979. I was 11, going on 12, when I left elementary school. We moved to L.A. to join the Sea Org.”
At 24:13 screen dump text: “In 1982, at the age of 16, Jackson was recruited to move to Gold Base in Riverside County, CA.”
‘Flag Order 3879’, 19 Jan 86 “The Sea Org & The Future”
At 24:37 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “The day after L. Ron Hubbard passed, there was this new flag order that came out. It was a miniature, little cardboard foldout. You flip it open. There was a picture of L. Ron Hubbard standing there at the helm on the ship with his ascot and his hat... very Sea Org like. And then on the other side, it had a miniature version of the flag order, and it was the introduction of Pat and Annie Broeker. And we were like, ‘So now we know who's in charge’.”
This could be easily seen as an attempt of Pat and Annie Broeker to establish their position in the Church, appointed with the “new rank of LOYAL OFFICER”. The Flag Order was indicated written and signed by L. Ron Hubbard who for the occasion had promoted himself to “the rank of ADMIRAL”. It was dated 5 days before it was said that L. Ron Hubbard passed away.
At 25:07 Leah Remini: “Then when did it change?”
At 25:09 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “The next day. I was part of the people that had to go around and collect all these issues and account for every single one of them, all those little pictures, all these pictures, taking them off notice boards, out of people's boxes. I had to get it, and we shred them and destroyed them.”
At 25:25 Leah Remini: “And who gave you that order?”
At 25:26 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “RTC.”
I recall that folding cardboard. I also can ascertain that the Flag Order was printed in ‘International Scientology News 8’, [ca Feb-Mar 86]. Jackson tells he was send out to located these cardboard foldouts at his location, but this didn't occur at Flag. Then as I was located in the Mimeograph/files section at Flag I knew the Flag Order was still in use and considered valid in 1987. It was not cancelled until ‘Flag Order 3879 Cancelled’ was issued by David Miscavige 18 Apr 88. This cancelling issue also noted that the original Flag Order wasn't issued when it was dated/written, but in “Mar 86” which aligns with its appearance in the ‘International Scientology News’ magazine. Full text of both Flag Orders and brief article of the ‘last’ Flag Order (as it was referred to at Flag), consult here (separate window).
It would seem that David Miscavige pulled a similar stunt, and he got away with it:
At 26:33 screen dump text: “The Church maintains that David Miscavige was appointed by L. Ron Hubbard to succeed him, although no written documentation of Hubbard's designation has been published.”
Gary “Jackson” Morehead relates about being ordered to establish the ultimate security system at Scientology International Base (Gold Base), Riverside County California. He shares his observations at 26:48-33:15.
Abortion again (jackson2)
At 33:31 Leah Remini: “So what was the thing that broke you?”
At 33:34 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “The thing that broke me is, my wife and I went through a pregnancy that she embarrassingly aborted. Pressured to. It's one thing to be told. It's a whole nother thing to be pressured to.”
At 33:59 Mike Rinder: “Within the Sea Organization in particular, it was determined that children were a distraction to the clearing of the planet, and there would no longer be children that Sea Org members had while they were in the Sea Organization. That is when you started to see the heavy pressure on women having abortions who got pregnant in the Sea Organization.”
At 34:02 we see on the TV show lifted sections taken from FO 3905-1. the problem is that it says nothing at all about abortions. So, this reference just does not support that abortion is what you're gonna do, it doesn't. The lifted sections also do not imply that. In fact the reference gives another solution.
Now we do see the quotations lifted from the FO, then the paragraph directly following states:
“Such Sea Org members will be sent to a Class V org for duty and in order to infuse Sea Org productivity and thus help the assigned Class V org expand. This issue establishes the exact lines to be used when a Sea Org member begets a child.”
Still no indication of an abortion taken place further on either:
“Once the child reaches 6 years of age and is able to hold a post in a Cadet org, the parents can become eligible for returning to the Sea Org provided that they have visibly expanded the org and area they were sent to.”
An aborted child just can not reach “6 years of age”.
It would seem to me that the presentation of this as it appears on the TV show is false, or in the very least misleading...
At 34:29 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “I was so happy that she was pregnant. I knew what I was up against, but I convinced myself that I could sell them on allowing us to have a kid. ...
Oh, no. And suddenly, it just went, Jackson, you better scramble and come up with the right words out of your mouth really quick.”
It is not questioned here that this did not happen, It is only making clear it wasn't Scientology and it wasn't directed even by that Flag Order that the TV show presents.
It is this that I don't get:
At 35:36 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “But, Leah, I had to sell her on it. And she didn't... neither one of us wanted to leave. We were still convicted followers. So you're in conflict. To go down that path, you lose your whole life. You lose your friends.”
What “friends”? If they stand by and watch an abortion enforced that you don't want? Why do you want to stay if they require this? Being like “convicted followers” is here the same as saying that one has been caught up in a mental prison devoid of reason, it is this what defines a culty. It is just all so sad...
It was to no avail either way:
At 35:52 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “And then I get my meter check, and my needle's dirty. My meter check and my dirty needle led up to them looking at my background and going, ‘Oh, we need to go get a hold of your wife and start interrogating her as the cause of all this’. I hear people yelling at her, and I hear her voice. I was like, ‘My wife's over there,’ and I blew by the guys who were at my door, went down there, and just started pushing and slugging and got in there and got a hold of my wife. That resulted in ‘That's it on Jackson’. My badge was ripped out of my shirt. The shoulder patches, everything were ripped off of me. You're no longer the Security Chief.”
At 37:02 screen dump text: “Between 1996 and 1997, Jackson was isolated from his wife and subjected to extensive security checks.”
At 37:07 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “I was confined, and I had two people assigned to me during the day and a guard assigned to me at night, following me around all day, every day long. And in the meantime, that auditor, that sec checker was telling my wife the results of my counseling and my sec checks.”
Wow, and since when is that the role of an auditor or a sec checker for that matter according to Scientology? Of course bad things are being told by this individual.
At 37:53 screen dump text: “Jackson and his wife separated soon after these events.”
Still Jackson is thinking:
At 37:57: “Where does this happen at? This is Scientology. I mean, I remember thinking, this is the Sea Org. This is the Int Base. It doesn't get any higher. How can this be happening?”
May be because..., it is not Scientology?
At 38:47 screen dump text: “In 1997, Jackson left the Sea Org.”
The continuous meandering mind of Leah Remini... (jackson3) ‘the evil of David Miscavige’
At 39:58 Gary “Jackson” Morehead: “David Miscavige was a new level of evil in the Church of Scientology, And I was an executioner of his directives, his evil directives.”
Right, so Jackson names “David Miscavige” and “his evil directives”. Not someone else, no, David Miscavige...
At 40:07: “This is not about a religion. This is not a fight for what's right. This is holding Dave Miscavige accountable for his actions.”
Keep this in mind...
At 40:39 Leah Remini: “You did nothing that wasn't taught to you. Please tell me you know that.”
So, whó taught him?
At 41:48: “And Jackson believed, ‘I'm doing the right thing.’ Why do I think I'm doing the right thing? Because I was taught that anybody who L. Ron Hubbard puts in charge is to be listened to, is to be respected, and they have Scientology's best interest at heart.”
I am sorry, but where does it ever said any such thing in Scientology?
And did it not already state in this véry episode at 26:33:
Thus “no written documentation”! What is Leah Remini nót getting?! Scientology was not either about a person, it was about the information and the auditing technology...
At 42:30 Leah Remini: “Is it true that David Miscavige is bad? Yes. But if David Miscavige wasn't there, they would grab... Guillaume Lesêvre, and they'd, you know, give him a shower and put a suit on him, and then he would carry on the same legacy. Because that is what Scientology teaches. So they are only upholding L. Ron Hubbard's policy.”
Scientology teaches a TECHNOLOGY for practice. It does not teach you to be a submitting listener that needs to obey and believe all they are told by some person or something. It is people that ultimately make a cult. The Church was made into a cult, and how and when did that happen, and who was responsible for that? Hmm... This whole episode lays it out in the open! Look!
At 42:05 Leah Remini: “And if I don't listen, the planet will be destroyed, and he was earnestly doing his job, thinking that he was protecting the planet. Like, protecting the planet's salvation, and that's what they all believed. This is the game that Scientology plays. This is David Miscavige following Scientology policy.”
Wow! Really? An interesting notion, because... David Miscavige when his time of reign officially took off (1982) he arranged that various policies were written per his directions. Probably the most infamous one is HCOB 10 Sept 83 “PTS-ness and Disconnection”. The original disconnection from the 60s was misapplied and was for that reason cancelled as early as 1968. In 1983 deliberately this misapplication and worse was suddenly brought back. Robert Vaughn Young admitted in an affidavit that he wrote it by order of David Miscavige (see here, separate window). Another thing that came about in this time frame was an internal snitch system through the release of HCO PL 22 Jul 82 “Knowledge Reports”. Turning people who did not inform fellow staff to an “ACCESSORY to the crime”. Now, whose ‘policy’ is being followed here? Care to account for these things, Leah Remini?!
Principles of Scientology teach that dishonest behaviour, lying, and so on, are not the road to walk on in Scientology. Wasn't Leah Remini this obedient servant that did nothing other than what she was told. Not taught, no... told! All these 35 years in Scientology and she never got it. She still doesn't get it now she is out. Or... is she really out? She is still covering David Miscavige's back! This is rather amazing considering that she has been reporting about him in her TV show this far.
A relevant overview of the RTC can be consulted at link here below: (separate window)
‘Scientology and Celebrity: The Betrayal of Paul Haggis’ (s2e06 - 19 Sept 2017)
[Wiki: Remini and Rinder interview Academy Award-winning filmmaker and former Scientologist Paul Haggis and a former Scientology recruiter about the church's strategy of recruiting celebrities.]
At 3:51 Mike Rinder: “It's hard to dispute that from the very earliest times, Hubbard was almost obsessed with getting celebrities into Scientology.”
At 4:04: From ‘Ability Minor II’ [Mar-Apr 55], page 2
Click to expand
Not sure how you get it to being “obsessed” with this? It's a logical thing to do if you want to expand, it means that you promote. Why using these exaggerating condescending commentaries, as if something is wrong with the person, putting these words in people's heads. Why?
L. Ron Hubbard only now and then wrote articles in these magazines. And if he wrote it then it would be signed by him. Therefore, we can safely assume that L. Ron Hubbard did not write the article in the ‘Ability’ magazine. It is actually unsigned. These magazines were not run by him, they were a means to the Scientology parishioner and even outside public. There is no record that I know of that much was happening since 1955 on that front. That's how “obsessed” it was...
On Wikipedia we find:
“The Celebrity Centre International was established in Los Angeles, California in 1969 by Yvonne Gillham and Heber Jentzsch in the Château Élysée, a 1920s building that had been built to replicate a 17th century French-Normandy chateau.”
If you are obsessed then will you wait with setting up a centre for 14 years? Not likely... L. Ron Hubbard did not even establish the centre. We don't know how much or if he was involved at all with this. Considering his workload in these years it is really not very likely that he was. Or it must be that Mike Rinder still thinks he was superhuman...
At 5:01: ‘FO 3484’, 1 Aug 74 “ Celebrity Centre Purpose”
It is signed ‘Lt. Cmdr. D.H. Horwich’ who in fact is Diana Hubbard, the eldest daughter of L. Ron Hubbard. L. Ron Hubbard did not write this either. I have a recollection, from going through Scientology materials, that she was involved with this for a short while.
This is all the TV show does offer, which isn't very much. At that they forgot to mention the Celebrity Centre wasn't established until 1969. It is only during the later 70s that we see some more activity at this front. At that time they also managed to get John Travolta involved.
Either way the claim made by Mike Rinder, this about a “Hubbard” being “(almost) obsessed” really wasn't “hard to dispute”!
At 5:19 screen dump text: “Mike and Leah are meeting with Karen Schless Pressley, a former Celebrity Centre recruiter.”
At 5:30 screen text: “Joined Scientology in 1981, Celebrity Centre executive, left Scientology in 1998”
At 5:27: “I'm Karen Schless Pressley, and I was a celebrity recruiter and commanding officer of the Celebrity Centre network for the Church of Scientology. When we would recruit celebrities in, we were really looking for people who could become mouthpieces for Scientology. That's the bottom line.”
At 10:58 Karen Schless Pressley: “Who do we see right now in the news promoting Scientology? No one.”
At 11:03 Leah Remini: “That Scientology doesn't work.”
Wow, that is truly a simplified and for all naïve answer... It does not have to mean that at all, always thinking the worst.
The story of Paul Haggis (celebrity defector)
At 13:43 screen text: “Scientologist for 35 years, Academy aware winning filmaker, philanthropist, founder of ‘Artists for Peace and Justice’”
At 13:37: “I'm Paul Haggis, and I became a Scientologist when I was very young, and I broke with them in 2009.”
Left 2009 - 35 years in = joined 1974.
At 13:53 Paul Haggis: “Scientology does appeal to a certain kind of people, and loners, people who didn't get a college education, like myself, people that didn't study philosophy or psychology, but especially those who were kind of predisposed to be loners, are a good target for them, because every loner secretly wants to be part of a group. But if you're gonna be part of a group, it should be one that everyone reviles.”
Sort of noteworthy because that is not the public that got in during the 50s and 60s, they were the other type of people, the educated ones. They were interested in the auditing technology and its principles of Scientology, it was the technical content that was the attraction. An overall delineation can be observed about that the type of pubic that got attracted since the early/later 70s was different from that. There are reasons for that and one of them is that the presentation of Scientology as we see in Scientology magazines got more New Age oriented. A variety of things that got published since then were not particularly an advantage to the topic of Scientology.
At 15:30 Paul Haggis: “There are concepts that just don't quite make as much sense, but by then, you're completely indoctrinated. You've been in for a while, and your friends are all Scientologists. Usually your relationships are largely Scientologists. And they aren't questioning it, so why should you?”
A strange notion. What “concepts”? Then why did you got in if you leave your sense for reason behind you? Then did you join for the right rationale?
At 15:52 Mike Rinder: “The further you go and the more indoctrinated you become in Scientology, the more you believe that anything wrong with it is your fault because you failed in some way to be a good Scientologist.”
That only happens if you got in with the wrong motivation...
At 16:16 Paul Haggis: “And I did a lot of courses, and I did all of the auditing, every single bit. I went from the bottom to the top of the Bridge. I went to, at the time, OT VII. The OT materials just didn't make any sense to me. I didn't get the gains they said I would get, but didn't mean I didn't try. I applied myself as best I could. ...
And I thought, ‘I'll try it. It might work’. Well, it didn't, you know. It was just nonsense for most of it. The beginning, good. After that, nonsense. That's when I realized this just wasn't for me.”
It would interesting to learn which Bridge he had done. The one that emerged in 1978 that was turned upside down or the original Bridge. Paul Haggis joined Scientology in 1974. Yes, there are issues with this later Bridge.
At 17:53 Paul Haggis: “They're an incredibly orthodox religion, but they pretend it's not. They give you the impression that it's about free thought and about questioning. It's not at all about any of those things. They just can say it, so they pretend that they mean it, so that they can, I guess, pretend to themselves. And you do a lot of pretending to yourself. You do a lot of that.”
You have to pinch through the façade . I figured it was all“about free thought and about questioning”. I got interested because of rational reasons, not because of religious reasons. If you do, you do stay alert.
In 2008 there was an issue about Proposition 8 in California that aimed to ban same-sex marriages. On a list of supporters of this motion appeared the Church of Scientology, which turned an issue for Paul Haggis. (at 19:11)
At 19:18 Paul Haggis: “I mean, of course, it was personal, because I have two daughters who are gay. That would've upset me if my daughters were gay or if my daughters weren't gay.”
At 20:18: “The church will tell you that it embraces all people, that they do not discriminate, that they love gay people, and there are many gay members. It's a complete lie.”
Here we get Mike Rinder arguing about what the writings of Scientology supposedly say about homosexuals. The same arguments had already been presented in season 1/episode 8. I addressed this there, consult here (separate window).
Shortly after an interview was forwarded to Paul Haggis where Tommy Davis (spokesman of the Church back then) in where it is stated:
At 24:03 Tommy Davis: “We consider family to be a building block of any society, so anything that characterizes disconnection, or this kinda thing, it's just not true. There isn't any such policy in the church that's dictating who people should or should not be in communication with, you know. It just doesn't happen.”
At 24:30 Paul Haggis: “But just two years before, my wife had been told she had to disconnect from her parents.”
Paul Haggis herewith realized Tommy Davis was lying. Then:
At 24:58: “So I went, ‘Hmm, I wonder what else he's lying about,’ and for the first time, I started to look.”
Tommy Davis indeed was lying in regards to a practice of disconnection occurring, but it is another issue if it was ordained by actual references. I addressed a bit of this in season 1/episode 1, see here(separate window).
There was sufficient with media coverages with the advances of the Internet group Anonymous that were getting all around. Paul Haggis goes through these and other materials after which he then decides he can not stay in the Church of Scientology, and he accordingly resigns writing this long letter and sending it to 25 persons. This is quite a flap on the Church's lines and thus they try their best to have him change his mind. He wouldn't.
An interesting realization about how people behave:
At 29:22 Paul Haggis: “When I sent my letter, I figured any of my friends who read this would look at that and go ‘Wow, I know he is a person with integrity... I'd better look into it’. That's what I thought they would do. I really... I was naive.”
Paul Haggis appears a very conscionable individual. If he considers something is wrong, he is not going to be silent about it , and he will go public, this despite any opposition he may encounter. The last words he speaks on this episode are:
At 43:05 Paul Haggis: “They're actively participating in a lie. I don't know how you live with that.”
Indeed, that is the whole point here!
‘The Ranches’ (for children) (s2e07 - 10 Oct 2017)
[Wiki: Remini and Rinder meet Tara Reile and Nathan Rich, who attended Scientology's Mace-Kingsley Ranch School and discuss the abuses they experienced.]
At 1:11 Mike Rinder: “In 1987, celebrated Scientologists Debbie Mace and Carol Kingsley opened the first Mace-Kingsley Ranch in Palmdale, California. They promoted it as a place for youth to receive an education and a wholesome camp-like experience that would set them on their path to being good Scientologists. According to their promotion, the intention of the Mace-Kingsley Ranch was to deal with children of Scientologists who were in trouble, to use Scientology technology and auditing to get them on the straight and narrow and move them onto the first steps of the bridge.”
This episode of the TV show is all about the Mace-Kingley Ranch who was first located in Palmdale, Ca. and later moved to New Mexico. Leah Remini and Mike Rinder make it appear as if the conditions in this place would be exemplary for all facilities for children in Scientology. Their adjudication is based first on their own ideas, and secondly on this one facility (or ranch).
At 4:07 Leah Remini: “If you introduce children to Scientology technology, it starts with the belief that Scientology is saving the planet. Without Scientology, your soul will be doomed to hell for eternity and that you are a down stat and everything bad that happens to you happened to you because you made it happen.”
This would be mostly the case for second or third generation Scientologists, which are children. They are being taught this by their parents who got caught up in Scientology. The children though have no say in the matter and also have no where to go.
Scientology however is not this belief system as it is proclaimed to be. Of course if you have a means that can help people it comes with a certain responsibility. This however is not the same as adjudicating everyone to bad people if they do not worship ‘Scientology’. It would appear that particularly the lesser intelligent and the uneducated fall into this trap. It is still sad nonetheless. The present Church is not helping, in fact they are a serious part of the problem, because the Church gives out licenses. It says on the website of Mace-Kingsley that “Scientology religious philosophy are delivered throughout the world exclusively by licensees of the Church of Scientology International” (see also on TV show at 42:02).
The story of Nathan Rich (at Palmdale facility)
At 5:40 screen text: “Nathan Rich, third generation Scientologist”
At 5:37: “My name is Nathan Rich, and I was involved with Scientology for about 17 years. I was at the Mace-Kingsley Ranch in Palmdale from 1990 to '91 and the Mace-Kingsley Ranch in New Mexico from 1996 to 1999.”
At 7:53 Nathan Rich: “When I was about seven or eight, I started acting out a bit.”
Also he (at 8:19) “just wasn't acclimating to Scientology.”
At 8:23: “My mother started to really notice this. ... I think that the sort of drive that my mother had to take me to this ranch was that she probably thought that, for the future, it was gonna be hard for me to be a good Scientologist if I kept down this path, and she probably got pitched something about this ranch that will fix kids up and make them back into, you know, good Scientologists, and just went with it.”
At 9:49 Nathan Rich: “Life at the Palmdale ranch was generally that you... you wake up, you gotta clean your room immediately, and then you go and you have breakfast, and then you have a lot of what they call MEST work, which is essentially physical labor, and then you have to clean up everything after that, the whole... all the grounds, everything. You would do some type of schooling. Things that you need to study for Scientology.”
At 10:11 Leah Remini: “But not any schooling really?”
At 10:13 Nathan Rich: “No, there wasn't any, like, math or history or anything like that. ...
Each morning at the ranch, they would have a muster of all the kids, and then they would read aloud all of the commendations that people got. And then they would read aloud the KRs. So KR's a knowledge report, which means... it's kinda like a chit or writing up somebody who's done something wrong. So one kid kind of ratting out another kid. And at eight, you guys are writing reports on each other.”
So, no schooling, and you are expected to inform on your fellow ‘prison’ mates, oh sorry, the other kids. This snitching system came about under the reign of David Miscavige (see here, separate window).
Leah Remini asks about punishments.
At 10:53 Nathan Rich: “If you said a cuss word, for example, you would have to do what they called Suzy-Qs, which are kind of modified squat jump push-ups, and then it goes up from there.”
Nathan Rich was being a kid, basically, got dirty, and thus:
At 11:13. “One of the security guards ... took me out from muster to that communal shower stall and had all of the students and staff, including the girls, surround the fence and look in
while he scrubbed me with a metal fence brush.”
It says “security guards”, it really all does sound like a prison camp and then the brutalities that occur.
At 11:44 Nathan Rich: “If any kids tried to bring up, you know, ‘Why are you treating us like this? We're just kids,’ which actually has happened before, then he would just bring out the policies that say, very clearly, that children essentially should be treated as adults and use that as a justification for punishing you.”
Here at 12:03 to 12:19 the TV show presents lifted quotes from ‘The Scientology Handbook’ (page 497). Two of them say: “A child is a man or a woman who has not attained full growth.” and “Any law which applies to the behaviour of men and women applies to children.”.
It does acknowledge “has not attained full growth”, what does that imply? That you need to punish brutally because a kid does kid's stuff?
Now, where do adults get “scrubbed” “with a metal fence brush” because they are a bit “scrappy” or “dirty” for doing kid's stuff? Obviously that what is said about (Scientology) “policies” is just an excuse to use brutality on kids that are “eight years old”. It gets worse...
At 12:35 Nathan Rich: “So the first time that I smoked a cigarette was also at the ranch. Another kid and I found it under a table, and so we smoked part of it.”
Apparently another kid informed on them, a KR was written. The punishment was (at 12:55) “Three paddles each”.
At 12:59: “And so the paddle was a big, wooden paddle with holes drilled through it and notches on it from all the kids who had been hit by it. And Wally would reach up, get it down from the wall, and he would bend you over a couch in front of all the kids and staff, and then he would hit you with it. People would kind of put tissues in their underpants, and so sometimes you would have to take your pants down or even take your underwear down to get paddled.”
In some strange distorted manner they would blend Scientology into all this...
At 13:41: “Like, if you're supposed to be in the Enemy condition, he'll read, and he'll be like, you know, an Enemy is this person and that person that is this way. And then he'll basically be kind of telling you that you're that Enemy or you're a Liability to the group... And then dish the punishment out to you.”
In fact this is a gross distortion of the conditions, they are not supposed to be applied like this at all. It is not a means of “punishment”. At 13:39 to 14:05 the TV show now presents lifted quotes from ‘Introduction to Scientology Ethics’ (page 102). Neither of them say anything at all about physical brutalities or even punishments as such. So, what exactly does Leah Remini and the TV show try to convey here?
At 14:05 Nathan Rich: “Is it all him? No, because you've got the backing of policy now. And that actually makes it scarier, because, instead of just one guy who's got some problem, he's a guy with the power of this religion behind him.”
Wow, really? Of course they pretend to have that with such distortions, in reality however you are dealing here by the looks of it, with sadist that enjoy using physical abuse and brutalities on children that are just eight years old. Punishments that by far do not match the ‘crime’ (that is if you call it crime, which it is not).
Here at 14:11 the TV show lifts out another quote from another source. It is from HCO PL 5 Jan 68 that is about “Overfilled in-Basket”, the lifted quote reads: “MAKE THE PENALTIES FOR NONCOMPLIANCE AND FALSE REPORTS TOO GRUESOME TO BE FACED AND ENFORCE THEM”. So what you you gonna do, physically beat the crap out of them with “paddles”? Do Leah Remini and the TV show understand the difference between “punishment” and “PENALTIES”? Read the whole policy letter and see what it is about and what else it says. It is wholly disrelated to what is happening in this prison camp, oops ranch.
At 14:44 to 15:20 the TV shows/plays an “Alleged Audio Recording of Wally Hanks and 15-year old Marco” who is getting a physical beating. Utterly gruesome! Some phrases: “Marco... Marco... Look at that picture of LRH. This is his policy. ... I said bent over.” And the beating starts. How is this Scientology or got anything to do with it? This Wally Hanks is simply a sadist, acknowledge and deal with that.
Leah Remini ‘explains’...
At 16:01 “Scientology schools are run on Scientology technology. It doesn't matter if you're just an average Scientologist. It is all run the same way... Learn what LRH is saying exactly. Apply it exactly to yourself and to your children.”
Wow, “exactly”? They are all getting beatings with “paddles”? Does “LRH” say that? Where “exactly”? There is nothing in Scientology writings that says that you even are supposed to be doing any of that. The people that I know and have known that are in Scientology will laugh Leah Remini into her face when she says something like that.
I said this before but ‘Dianetics’ (1950), ‘Child Dianetics’ (1951), ‘The Second Dynamic’ (1981) and ‘The Way to Happiness’ (1981) all speak against Leah Remini.
At 16:22 screen dump text: “In 1991, Nathan was taken out of the Palmdale Ranch and moved with his family to Clearwater Florida.”
The story of Tara Reile (at New Mexico facility)
At 6:36 screen text: “Tara Reile, third generation Scientologist”
At 6:33: “I'm Tara Reile. I went to Mace-Kingsley Ranch School in New Mexico from February of 1996 to December of 1997.”
At 16:41 Tara Reile: “When I was 11, I caught my dad, literally, cheating on my mother. I was upset about it, and my grandma told me that, you know, it was my... it was my fault.”
At 16:54 Leah Remini: “What was your fault? That your father was cheating?”
At 16:55 Tara Reile: “That my parents were... well, that parents were probably gonna get divorced because I caught my father cheating on my mom.”
At 17:01 Leah Remini: “And your grandmother was a Scientologist?”
At 17:03 Tara Reile: “Yeah, I just remember, like, being devastated.”
Who are these for kind of people? What is this for a granny? A Scientologist? Wow! It is utter betrayal that this granny does. A divorce was upcoming...
At 17:21 Tara Reile: “My dad said, ‘We have nowhere to put you. Nobody wants you. I've heard of this place in New Mexico that, you know, I'm willing to pay for to, you know, get you some help’.”
“Nobody wants you.”? Wow!
At 17:50 Tara Reile: “He told me that I would only be there for three months. It was a three-month program. ‘I'm really proud of you for going, and, you know, hopefully, when you're done, you can come back and live with us at home’.”
Now they want her again (may be) after three months? Dit the father not say earlier: “We have nowhere to put you.”? This is contradictive...
At first all looked fine and exiting, “kids were horseback riding”, “waterfalls”, “this is amazing”.
At 18:26 Tara Reile: “We had our course down there, auditing, and, for all intents and purposes, it looked great. Like, I saw kids working and stuff like that, but I didn't realize until, like, day three that it was, like, holy shit this is a labor camp. The kids took care of the ranch. You know, like, the staff members were there to oversee everything and keep everything in line but we really were the ones that took care of it.”
We were (at 19:00) “cleaning, auditing, hard work, chopping wood, like tons of wood”, “Digging ditches or building fences”, “It was really strenuous and back-breaking”.
The story of Nathan Rich (2) (at New Mexico facility)
At 19:29 Nathan Rich, 14 years of age now, still “being a young rebel”, “not on course, not being in session”, and “not getting along with my mother”. He was tricked into agreeing going to another ranch, which he soon found out was the same ranch that now had moved to another location. He was told by the “security guard from the first ranch” that was getting him that “Wally's not there.”, “It's great. None of that old bad stuff happens. It's just camping and hanging out, and, you know, it's kind of fun”. Nathan was “snapping into reality and realizing what was happening”, he said “No, I'm not... I'm not going.” Then the “guard” grabbed him and took him to the ranch. Nathan tell that his mother “had been sitting there the whole time, and she was actually smiling when they were dragging me out.”. And this is called a mother...
Mike Rinder and Leah Remini ‘explain’...
At 22:48: “The punishment and the drive to deal with down stats is an effort to restrain your reactive mind. I mean, that is what is right in the Ethics book. L. Ron Hubbard has a theory that you can control and restrain those impulses that come from your reactive mind by putting enough pressure and threat of external consequences to prevent the reactive mind from taking charge. This is used as justification for why you put restraint on people, why you punish them and tell them if they do such and such, this will be the result.”
At 23:03 to 23:26 the TV show presents various lifted quotes from ‘Introduction to Scientology Ethics’ (page 335). Mike Rinder is quite wrong though. The lifted quotes say nothing at all about “punish”, nothing at all. Additionally he is forcing it into an incorrect application, the lifted quotes originally come from HCO PL 17 Mar 65 III “Administering Justice”. All policy letters inform about an exact area of application. Please read the whole policy letter.
You can throw a spin on any of these things and make it appear as if we are looking at something really bad. In this episode both Leah Remini and Mike Rinder have really excelled themselves in their insistence to place all the blame on L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology. It is twisting and turning.
At 23:46 Leah Remini: “It's not like you're ‘down stat’ for that week. You're given a label that you are bad. You're just, in general, bad, and everything that's happened from the age of three on up has been... you are bad. There's something wrong with you that Scientology is going to fix.”
That is what people do to others. If you want to succeed in to suppress them, that is what you do. Now, if Scientology was so bad, then why does it expose all these mechanisms that suppress people?
The Mace-Kingsley Ranch (2)
The living situation for both Nathan Rich and Tara Reile from here on out does even get worse while on this Mace-Kingsley Ranch now located in New Mexico. It is hard labour, poor food, no access to even warming water for noodles, dirty water to wash themselves with. I am not going through that here, if you want to watch that, get the episode. Tara Reile reveals that her father had been paying $150,000 to the people running the ranch. One may wonder what for? It is basically for running a slave labour camp for minors.
The people running that ranch succeeded to convince the parents and the children that this is all Scientology. Quite frankly I only see a gruesome distortion of Scientology principles throughout. Both Nathan Rich and Tara Reile appear to have been betrayed by their parents, they were supposed to take care of them, to protect them, instead they basically threw them out. When Nathan Rich (at 36:52), after pulling himself together (at age 23?) and wanted to attend school, he asked his mother for “tax information” to be able to take “study loans”, and she said no...
Amazingly enough this Mace-Kingsley is still in existence till this very day and located in Clearwater Florida. Not as a ranch as it seems, but as Mace-Kingsley Family Center that offers auditing and various guidance to children. I don't think I would recommend this place...
that is, not after an indeed very thorough check-up. You start with the accountability of the persons holding it in regards to the ranch.
At 40:55 Mike Rinder: “They still apply Scientology and L. Ron Hubbard technology as the basis of their program.”
“still apply”? Did they ever? Considering the betrayal and gross misapplication of Scientology on these ranches, they should be avoided as the plague. It is the same persons holding it...
At 41:06: “It also promotes the fact that Mace-Kingsley has a long history of operating successful ranches.”
At 41:18:
They did at the time of the filming of the episode, but not this day! Which is interesting... I checked it out and they appear to have removed it some time after Mar 2017 (last capture). Wikipedia states about the TV show: “a second, ten-episode season was announced by A&E in March 2017”.
Which rather noteworthy gives us a same month and year. There is no capture of the page during 1918-21. The present rewritten page (mention of the ranch removed) appeared first in Dec 2022. It does give the impression that the text about the ranches on their website much have been a source of uncomfortability of some sort for them.
At 0:11 (s2e08) we see this response from the Church on the episode:
Quite frankly, I don't see how that holds up. Was Mace-Kingsley not responsible, even if they may have hired other people to run the ranch? They ignored the problems for a great number of years...
‘The Greatest Good’ (s2e08 - 17 Oct 2017)
[Wiki:Exploring the theme of parental abandonment, Remini and Rinder speak to two former Church members: Mimi Faust, whose Scientologist mother abandoned her at age 13 when Faust refused to sign a contract with organization, and Christi Gordon, was sent to with her sister when they were 10 and 11 to live with the Cadet Org, where they suffered sexual molestation.]
At 0:40 Mike Rinder: “The goal that everybody has in the Sea Organization we are clearing the planet. We are doing the most important work that possibly anybody on Earth is doing. We cannot be distracted from that.”
Now, this is more or less correct, this is essentially the goal set for the Sea Org. But it also states: “Many are called, but few are chosen.” It is thus certainly not for everyone...
At 0:52: “We cannot be distracted from that. Nothing must deviate us from this road to accomplishing a clear planet, and every possible distraction is removed. Family in the Sea Org is something that is given lip service but isn't considered to be important. If you're married, you're unmarried, if you have kids, if you don't, if your parents are dead, if your parents are alive, all of that is completely irrelevant to, ‘Are you doing your job in the Sea Organization? Are you doing the greatest good and absolutely nothing else?’”
Where is the “greatest good” coming from? It comes from “The greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics”, and suddenly it starts to mean something rather different!
If you have a family and or kids that you need to attend to you may feel “called”, but you will (should) not be “chosen”, that is the simplicity of it!
Ignoring “distractions” when attention is required will not help getting this “clear planet”.
Mimi Faust, one of the guests in this episode that was abandoned as a child at age 13, because her mother had joined Sea Org, she tells:
At 23:32: “In my experience, Scientology tears families apart. If you can't keep a mother and child together, how are you supposed to unite the planet? Does that make any sense to you? 'Cause it doesn't make any sense to me at all.”
Indeed, why is this mother in the Sea Org at all? That is if you are unable or unwilling to be there for your child, which is your second dynamic.
“Needed and wanted are clean, non-LSD case type personnel who are an asset to FLAG and not supernumerary duds who are here for first or second Dynamic reasons only.
Get people who want to get the job Done. This is called hard-sell, you promote what are the conditions, the responsibilities, the importance of the job - you don't punch up the living conditions and the ‘free-time’. This will get you the type that WANTS to help the 4th dynamic and Clear the planet.” (attributed to) LRH (from LRH Advice 7 Jul 79)
Keeping Scientology Working (What is policy?)
At 3:58 Leah Remini: “Scientology offers the person who desperately wants to be more than what they are a mission of saving mankind, and the policy that feeds into that is called ‘Keeping Scientology Working’.”
At 4:14:
This is what Leah Remini makes of it (she speaks very passionate by the way):
At 4:13: “It says, ‘The agonized future of every man, woman, and child depends on what you do here and now in Scientology. This is our only chance to get out of the trap.’ So Scientologists are banking on, ‘Okay, I'm gonna sacrifice this lifetime because we're gonna clear the planet’. This is the chance now. And if we don't do it now, we might never have the chance again.”
Now go to the paragraphs directly following which are also the last two paragraphs of the policy letter. The read:
“Don't muff it now because it seems unpleasant or unsocial to do Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten.
Do them and we'll win.” LRH
So, the focus is on step “Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten.” If you never have read this policy letter, you will have no clue what that is all about, naturally.
Policy letters address exact issues. They deal with situations that are discussed in that policy letter to which a solution is offered that is likely to handle a given situation. A clue is already provided in the title of the policy letter as to what it is about. Now, this policy letter here gives us “Keeping Scientology Working”, it lays out 10 steps to ensure that. The policy is “to do Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten”.
Now, what Leah Remini does is going to the very end of the policy letter, that is seven pages long, and takes two paragraphs out of context, and accompanies them with a story of her own and makes that the policy. Impressive no?
Leah Remini repeatedly states something along the line of the ‘evil of L. Ron Hubbard's policy’. What remains to see if that statement holds up when we find literally hundreds of references once claimed to have been written by L. Ron Hubbard, but that were proven not written by him. Even the Church confirms this.
A problem with the TV show, Leah Remini and Mike Rinder is that the message is being conveyed that anything written by L. Ron Hubbard or seemingly deriving from him is policy that needs to blindly followed, or else... Just because they did that and very many of the quests, does not make it correct. Some distinction, pléase...
You will find more practical information about its use and boundaries at link here below: (separate window)
At 4:48 Leah Remini: “The saying is, ‘The greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics’. In Scientology, they have a thing called dynamics which is just taking every area of your life and separating them into eight departments. So your first dynamic would be yourself. Your second dynamic is your family. Third dynamic is groups, your job. Fourth dynamic is mankind. Fifth dynamic is living things up until your eighth dynamic which is infinity, God.”
So far so good, but then...
At 5:15: “And when making a decision in Scientology, a Scientologist will ask you, ‘Well, what's the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics? Do I pick my child who doesn't want to be in Scientology, that's one dynamic, in comparison to mankind, to sacrifice one for the betterment of the survival of mankind, not just this lifetime but for eternity?’”
Essentially she talks complete rubbish. She said it herself: “The greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics”. She doesn't talk about “the greatest number of dynamics”, she talks about one dynamic (dynamic two) as opposed to another also just one dynamic (dynamic four), how is that “the greatest number of dynamics”? There is more though, a lot more she appears not being aware of.
The dynamics of Scientology at 4:57-5:16:
Watch the little video presentation of the dynamics on the TV show, what do you see? You see circles. Bigger circles that encompass the smaller ones. Now understand the following:
“... we handle the first (self) and the second (sex and family) only to achieve better function on the third and fourth.” LRH (from ‘Scientology 0-8, The Book of Basics’ (1970))
What does that all mean? Well, Leah Remini does not understand the essentials of the dynamics, how they work and how they relate to each other.
Various references on dynamics:
“In order to BE the fifth dynamic, the individual must already have made a success of BEING the fourth. In order to BE the fourth, he must already have made a success of BEING the third, and so on.”
“... a complete person is made up, not only of the first and second dynamics, but also of the third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, and eighth dynamics — but the first and second are a good and indispensable start to becoming a complete person.
Most people have not yet begun to reach the first.”
“The achievement of BEING the first and second dynamics is part of the achievement of BEING the fourth dynamic.” LRH (from ‘Professional Course Booklet 29’, May 52 “Dynamics and the Tone Scale, Technique 80”; Summarization of Tape lecture: “Tone and Ability” & “Wavelength and Tone Scale” given on 19 May 52)
It also appears in full as a chapter in the publication ‘The Second Dynamic’ (issued 1981; pp 40-51: “Establishing a Cause Relationship”). The text and its illustrations thus have been widely available in various forms, this since 1952 and onwards. One may have to ask why Leah Remini nor Mike Rinder seem to be aware of the information it forwards?
“But there is the extreme of charity which neglects the first dynamic. An optimum solution would be that one which brought the greatest good to the greatest number of dynamics. Thus the auditor must not neglect the first dynamic--himself.” (from ‘Hubbard Professional College Announcement’, Oct 54 “Dianetics and Scientology - A Crusade”)
“7. To employ Scientology to the greatest good of the greatest number of dynamics.” LRH (from ‘PAB* 41’, 10 Dec 54 “The Code of a Scientologist”)
Responsibility and counter-responsibility
Christi Gordon is the other guest in this episode who suffered while being a very young child, since age 9, because of neglect when her mother joined the Sea Org. She commented:
At 26:41: “My mother began teaching us as she learned them and accepted them. Anything bad that happens to you, it was our fault.”
At 26:54-04:
This dump screen appears on the TV show as soon as she had said that. They also kept it there unusually long, see the timing. Is it trying to convey a message?
Of course this is a quotation pulled out of a longer text.
There is a behaviour to observe among Scientologists that induces them to place guilt onto persons that have suffered something or are somehow met with opposition. I have seen it, and I don't like it. Suddenly you may hear, “What did you do to have this happening to you?”. This however may be a way to flee from personal responsibility. For example if a child is being bullied, the parents are not helping the child if they place all the blame on the child. Obviously there is also the responsibility of the parents for their child. See, why did they got a child that suffers from the hardships of life? As a parent you are to guide the child and give support.
The concept of responsibility for whatever that comes unto your path is looked into by L. Ron Hubbard in various of his writings, this however certainly does not mean that you are invited to use that to blame a person and not help them. One should regard the whole text and not focus on a little piece of it or a paragraph trying to make a point that the whole text just wasn't conveying!
Society teaches us that one does not even need to have a quotation like the TV show is forwarding. The blame is, as in an unwritten rule, given to the one standing on the other side of a fence. It is common to run from own responsibilities and give it to the other. It is human behaviour.
Leah Remini no doubt will tell it is ‘Scientology policy’, no it is not policy. Her quotation is appearing in a book that looks into the matter of responsibility, its technical characteristics, and its mechanics, that's all. People however will use anything (policy or no policy) to their advantage or if it suits their purpose. Leah Remini is no exception.
‘The Business of Religion’ (s2e09 - 24 Oct 2017)
[Wiki: In the second of four special episodes, Leah and Mike lead a roundtable discussion with former Sea Org Member Matt Pesch, blogger Jeffrey Augustine, and ex-Scientologist Luis Garcia and his attorney Ted Babbitt to examine the contracts that all Scientologists must follow and the financial requests they're required to fulfill.]
At 0:32 Mike Rinder: “So we're here today to cover another aspect of the problem with Scientology, which is it presents itself as one thing and actually is another. And I think a great adage to follow is ‘If you want to know the truth about Scientology, follow the policy’.”
At 0:55 Leah Remini: “Scientology is different from any other ‘religion’. I don't like to say... call it a religion... but it's run as a business. It has a business model.”
No argument there.
At 1:18: “But what they do is the Bridge to Total Freedom, which is what you're buying in Scientology, you're buying what's called the Bridge to Total Freedom, and there are exact steps from the bottom to the top that you have to pay for. And it's an exact price. That's a business!”
Prices will be in a different range if you do the same service in a local Cl. IV organization or an advanced organization. The prices can also be cut considerably if you co-audit with another person, where both train for being an auditor (they pay for the study course) after which they audit each other in turn. It's true that for each of the options listed there is a particular set price.
It does not mean however that no other options were accounted for. There is this thing called student auditing. An auditor in training has to train on live persons at some point, so he/she will look for persons that will volunteer which is of no charge for the person. There were always auditors looking for volunteers. If you were lucky you could get a good portion of your Bridge for free this way. An initiative for an organized “student clinic” was suggested by HCO PL 17 May 65 III “Free Scientology Center”. I touched this in brief in season 1/episode 3, see here (separate window).
This free of charge student auditing is pending what process the student needs to train, it is also not professional auditing from an graduated auditor. It certainly does have its flaws, but it will cost you nothing financially.
At 1:37 Mike Rinder: “Scientology is a very different model than other religions. Most religions have a voluntary donation that you make. You go to a service, and they pass around a collection plate, and you put whatever you can afford in there or want to give.
Some religions have tithing, where you're expected to give a percentage of your annual income.
Scientology has a model which is fixed prices, discounts for massive pre-payment of things, people collecting commissions by getting other people to give money. Exactly delineated promises. You don't go to the Catholic Church and hear the promise of ‘this is exactly what we will give you if you give us your money’. For this particular thing.”
At 3:09: “And that is the difference, the single difference between Scientology and any other religion is, you are required to pay before participating in the services of Scientology.”
That is not untrue, but also not entirely true. It will at least cost you a book, there are quite an amount of processes that can be run from a book. It's like you go to a Catholic Church and you purchase a Bible. Where is the difference?
You thus can participate in a Scientology organization without having “to pay before participating”. In the organization they may hunt you to have you pay for things/services, but you can just say no. Just as I did many times.
“Exactly delineated promises”, is that really so? That you have are end phenomenas of processes. It means that areas have been adressed that have relieved problems in these areas. Some more info here (separate window).
At 3:33 Mike Rinder: “And the other thing, Leah, is that Scientology's developed all these other reasons why you have to turn over money.
You have, how much money do you have to give to the IAS, the International Association of Scientologists. You can be a lifetime member for $5,000. But you can't get onto the higher levels of Scientology without being a Patron, which is $50,000.”
I have actually not ever heard about such a requirement! Where does it say that?
At 3:59: “And the Ideal Orgs program. Which is an idea that we are going to buy new buildings for all the churches of Scientology everywhere, and you're gonna give us your money so that we can fix them.”
I have never heard about any Ideal Orgs requirement either.
At 5:05 Mike Rinder: “Just one other thing that people ask a lot, how is it that Scientology has billions of dollars? Because Scientology, if you walk out into the world, hasn't got a huge presence. It's not McDonald's, it's not Starbucks, it's not the Catholic Church. Yet, it has accumulated literally billions of dollars. How?
So what we're gonna hear about and cover today when... in this Follow the Policy is how Scientology goes about getting people in and then how they go about persuading them to part with their money and how they go about controlling that money so that once they've got it they never let go.”
‘Follow the policy’: Refund policy and rights
At 6:02:
At 6:04 Leah Remini: “What we're talking about now is this is money that you've given for future services that you're never going to get in Scientology. I'm never going to do my OT VIII, IX, and X. and all this other crap that I could be doing in Scientology... things that I paid for. Never gonna do it. And there's thousands like me. Who have money sitting on account in a Church of Scientology that is making the Church of Scientology millions.”
At 6:38 Leah Remini: “But if Scientology is run on policy, and policy is to be followed why isn't this policy of refunds and repayments followed?”
At 6:48 Mike Rinder: “Because they develop and use other policies to circumvent those things. If you request your money back, you are declared a Suppressive Person. You are no longer in good standing with Scientology.”
At 7:05:
“And therefore you have no rights as a Scientologist. Therefore, you may not come into the building. And, in order to get your money back, you have to go and see people on what's called a routing form. But they're not allowed to talk to you. And you're not allowed to go into the building. So you can't do it, so they say, ‘Well, you can't do the routing form, so our requirement is that you do the routing form in order to get your money back’. But you can't do the routing form because we've just declared you a Suppressive Person for saying you want your money back.”
1.
Where does it say in this policy letter that if you have made yourself guilty of one “Suppressive Act” that it will lead to a suppressive person declare? Read the reference, it doesn't say that. True, some acts do lead to that, but if that be the case it is specified in that policy letter specifying that for given reason! This policy letter here states: “Suppressive acts are clearly those covert or overt acts knowingly calculated to reduce or destroy the influence or activities of Scientology or prevent case gains or continued Scientology success and activity on the part of a Scientologist.” You have to show that, for which reason you also have the right “for recourse or redress wrongs.” This HCO PL was issued during a difficult time as the organization was under serious attacks during the early 60s. Either way, read what this policy letter says and does not say...
2.
But here it comes. The claim of Mike Rinder about the fees is VERY SERIOUSLY FALSE! In the TV show the text that is lifted from that HCO PL 23 Dec 65 RB “Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists”, is cut short! The complete text reads (underlying is mine): “Demanding the return of any or all fees paid for standard training or processing actually received or received in part and still available but undelivered only because of departure of the person demanding (the fees must be refunded but this policy applies).”. It says that “the fees must be refunded”! If the makers of the TV show can cut short a sentence and indicate that with “...”, then they also must have seen what it says in the remainder of the sentence. Did they really think that no one would notice this?
At that a person asking for a refund is an actual failure of the organization. The only consequence that I have seen of people requesting and receiving refunds is that they were not welcome to receive further services in the organization. I have no recollection of declares being issued because of asking for a refund, at least not prior to 1990. If there were I would have seen them at the mimeograph/files section at Flag.
“A refund policy is an agreement type policy. Needful. But it must be very mild indeed or it will stand in lieu of good service.” LRH (from HCO PL 23 Oct 63 “Refund Policy”)
Does that sound like being eligible for a suppressive person declare? This HCO PL also talks about an occurrence in “Australia” in where monies were “not immediately refunded”. The “first thought on finding the matter out should have been to refund the money, not because of threatened legal action, but because AN ORGANIZATION IS BOUND BY THE CODE OF A SCIENTOLOGIST.”. See this code here (pop-up window).
Mike Rinder's “follow the policy” does mean here that “the fees must be refunded”.
Oxford Capacity Analysis (OCA)
At 9:10 Mike Rinder: “I think that, probably, it's a good idea to start at the very beginning of how someone gets in this machine to take your money because you're walking down the street, and you're walking past the Church of Scientology, how do you end up inside writing a check? ”
At 9:24: “Well, the first thing is you have a free personality test. And in that test it's 200 questions, and it's called the Oxford Capacity... Oxford...”
Here Leah Remini gets help from Mike Rinder, when she does not seem to know/remember even what's it called, at 9:27-9:38:
At 9:34 Mike Rinder: “OCA.” - Leah Remini: “Yes.”
At 9:47 Leah Remini: “You go in, you take this test, you believe that it's a bona fide test from some legit place. It isn't.”
Wow! First she has obvious problems with recalling what the test is called, but is then very quick with adjudicating it is not “bona fide”. What does she actually know about that? Duh... It was developed in the late 50s at the behest of L. Ron Hubbard. A test was needed to accurately determine traits or lack of traits in a person and the reason for it. The test appears rather effective and accurate in this regard. It is however true that it does need a person that is properly trained in explaining the test. This is not always the case, in particular in much later years.
If the test was inaccurate and not working you simply will not get people interested in doing anything in Scientology...
At 9:56: “And then, after you take the test, they give you the results instantly. And for that you're sent to whom?”
At 10:01 Mike Rinder: “The registrar.”
Actually this is not the correct sequence or action! The registrar (the actual person writing people up for services) is not explaining the test to the person. The person is only then send to a registrar if interest is shown by the person to take a service, not before. During the 80s at Amsterdam org I recall clearly we had persons that had a good result of the test, and they were let go. They were asked if they had any interest, but very little effort was taken with such persons. It simply was useless to try if they were doing well in life and had a good test result. They never saw any registrar.
The TV show really gives a simplicity version of all this. It just wasn't like that in 80's and not even in the ’90s at many places.
‘Big League Sales’ and ‘hard sell’
At 10:51 Mike Rinder: “And there is a book that is the Bible of Registrars in Scientology called 'Big League Sales'. The registrar, I mean, they literally, before they start work, sit across from each other and drill every objection you can think of so they can like come up with it quick, quick, quick, bang. Like, there are these various techniques that have been developed of how you get someone to give you their money.”
That I can tell is that registrars had a copy of the book, and there were also hatting courses in Scientology to get familiar with the techniques that the book offered. It was written by Les Dane, an expert on so-called closing techniques. Full title of the book is ‘Big League Sales Closing Techniques’ (1971).
I guess if you actually ended up with the registrar it was their job to sell you something. The idea was to have a person to enroll on something he wanted or needed. Les Dane's book was used as a tool to not fail with that. Yes, pretty business-like all this. The original idea was not just to “give you their money”, but this unfortunately has grown to be like that.
At 12:31 Mike Rinder: “And then there is a bunch of things that are written by Hubbard about hard sell. That you must hard sell people. That you never offer people a choice.”
Indeed, but the concept was, at least once it was, that you were “caring about the person” in order that he got that he needed and thus you were “not being reasonable with stops and barriers and getting him fully paid up and taking the service”LRH (from ‘LRH ED 159R-1 Int’, 18 Feb 73). You were not supposed to sell the person that he did not need, just for that sake to get money out of the person. You were supposed to have the person “to get the person the service that's going to rehabilitate him.” LRH(from HCO PL 26 Sept 79 III “Copywriting”). Unfortunately, this attitude started to change more and more since the 80s. Today it seems pretty much abandoned, or rather it started to be used as a pretense by many registrars. In the earlier years there was a choice, but not in today's Church. They have become relentless. It all has become a bad culture. It is not all that surprising as the production/statistics of the registrar is measured in gross income and not satisfied customers. Registrars started to put more and more under a lot of pressure by the new management that came into place in the early 80s, the focus changed to for profit (see here, separate window).
‘The Hard Sell Pack’ (1987) which presented a collection of references taken “from the works of L. Ron Hubbard” was in use by many staff.
Legal papers
At 19:59 Mike Rinder: “So we're gonna have a little discussion about enrollment forms in Scientology. It is a very particular thing that Scientology has put in place in order to protect itself and protect itself from having to give money back.”
At 20:22 screen dump: “Jeffrey Augustine: Former Scientologist, Investigative journalist, Scientology policy expert”
At 20:23 Leah Remini: “So we're joined by Jeffrey Augustine.”
At 29:16 Jeffrey Augustine: “Generally in America when you make a religious donation it's irrevocable, it's a gift that you don't expect to get back. So you have to agree that the Church has no legal obligation to return any donation nor do you have any legal obligation to get one, except at the sole discretion of the Church.”
At 29:40:
This factually goes against HCO PL 23 Oct 63 “Refund Policy” that is written by L. Ron Hubbard. This Enrollment Application form is not. Therefore HCO PL Refund Policy is senior and has to be applied.
At 29:44 Jeffrey Augustine: “There's a famous letter on the Internet, and basically a fellow had money on account. Say $100,000. He was declared a Suppressive Person. Because he asked for a refund and he caused trouble. Now, once you're declared a Suppressive Person, you're not allowed to step foot on a Church property.
So the Church wrote him a letter saying, ‘In order to get your refund, you would have to come onto Church property to complete the CVB Routing Form’. However, because you've been declared a Suppressive Person, you're not allowed to step foot on the Church. Therefore, because you can't complete the step we're not giving you your money back.”
I recall seeing this letter. An absurd text and violating the stipulations found in the HCO PL 23 Oct 63 “Refund Policy”, but also HCO PL 23 Dec 65 RB “Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists”. Jeffrey Augustine mentions here that the person also “caused trouble”, he fails however to give details. It would appear this person was acting out in ways. Still the refund per the two references here above named need to be followed up on.
At 30:45 Jeffrey Augustine: “Here's the bottom line. If you were to run the gauntlet and they were to give you your repayment, you're gonna be declared an SP. And everybody you know and love will have to shun you. So that big piece of emotional blackmail is presented at the beginning. That usually deters people. So you can't have an attorney involved. It's within our sole ecclesiastical authority whether you get it or not, and we're going to make you do a big runaround to get it. The whole bad faith process of the Church is to wear you down and get you to abandon it.”
That is “If you were to run the gauntlet”. Jeffrey Augustine essentially does message here that asking for a refund by itself is not enough to have you declared. It is true enough that the Church really doesn't want to pay out refunds. They would like you to forget about it or they may even provoke you to do something they can then hold against you.
At 32:06 Leah Remini: “It's insane to me that not many people have been able to come up against Scientology to try to get their money back.
And that's why we wanted to talk to Luis Garcia and his lawyer Ted Babbitt.”
L. Ron Hubbard in HCO PL 23 Oct 63 “Refund Policy” says this about that:
“In 13 years involving hundreds of thousands of hours of processing and millions of dollars of income, in any organization where I was assuming direct command I have always promptly and immediately caused to be refunded every penny of the money paid by any person who was dissatisfied with his or her processing. This has been the consistent policy I myself have worked with.
In all that time I have only refunded about $3,500.
This low amount of refund is also due in part to my firm policy that persons who demand refunds may have them exactly according to the Code of a Scientologist, but that any person demanding or accepting refunds thereafter shall be refused as an HGC* preclear and posted for the information of field auditors.” LRH
At 32:21 Leah Remini: “Now, Luis, you were a Scientologist for 28 years. You went all the way up the Bridge to OT VIII.”
At 32:33 Luis Garcia: “Then I became disillusioned. I started to learn the actual truth of what the Scientology organization is. I started to learning about the lies and the deception, the fraud.
It's a very hard thing to confront the idea that they might be lying to you, that you've been the subject of a con.
You spend your whole lifetime putting your energy, your money, sacrificing time away from family, away from business. Life. Finally, you finish OT VIII, and you realize that it was all a scam. That you're not where you should be. You're not where they told you you were gonna be.”
Scientology was never about that you were going to be told this or that. This whole Bridge has these detailed descriptions or end phenomena to which you attested that you reached them. These were there for the parishioners, that it was you that was in control basically. And then it takes “28 years” and after having paid “millions”, isn't that illogical? Then what did you do all these years, really?! These people are a mystery to me...
At 34:23 Jeffrey Augustine: “But you can see the necessity of the contracts is we're not making any claims.”
At 34:26 Leah Remini: “But they have promised us a lot just by the very Bridge. It says ‘abilities gained’. They do promise you the whole way up. It's bullshit.”
These “abilities” were not promises. They were there to have the parishioner understand where they were at and were done with that process.
On the older Bridges they were much more detailed and for a reason! See here (separate window).
The TV show, Leah Remini, Mike Rinder and virtually all guests that make an appearance have taken an effect position. Why? They were there, were they not? If you are defrauded, do you not choose to be defrauded? You don't need to be defrauded.
At 39:36 Mike Rinder: “There is a United States Supreme Court decision [1989] that says donations to Scientology are not deductible because they are quid pro quo. Meaning, you get something in exchange.
And yet the IRS has determined that those donations are deductible. In spite of a U.S. Supreme Court decision saying these are not charitable donations, the IRS determined [1993] that Scientology is a religious charitable organization because those two things don't square.”
What does this tell you about the IRS? Rumours have hit the Internet about that the deal in reality meant that Scientology was sold out to the IRS or rather the entity that is behind or controlling the IRS. This however goes beyond the purpose of this page, research at your own leisure.
Vocabulary:
audit, auditing, auditor:
The application of Scientology processes and procedures to someone by a trained auditor (listener). The goal of the auditor is to make the receiver of the auditing look at incidents and reduce the mental charge which may lay upon them. The auditor may not evaluate and has to adhere to the Auditor's code. Dynamics:
The urge, thrust and purpose of life – SURVIVE! – in its eight manifestations. The First Dynamic, survival of self; the Second Dynamic, the urge toward survival through sex and children; the Third Dynamic, the urge to survive through a group. The Fourth Dynamic, the urge to survive through all mankind; the Fifth Dynamic, the urge to survive through all living things; the Sixth Dynamic, the urge toward survival as the physical universe; the Seventh Dynamic, the urge toward survival through spirits or as a spirit; the Eighth Dynamic, the urge toward survival through infinity. (Marriage Hats booklet) Flag Order (FO):
This is the equivalent to a policy letter (HCO PL) in the Sea Org (senior organization within the Church of Scientology). Contains policy and sea technical materials. They are numbered and dated. They do not decay, HCO PLs and FOs are both in effect on Sea Org orgs, ships, offices and bases. Black ink on white paper. Distribution to all Sea Org members. It is vital for SO units to have master files and quantity of FOs from which hats can be made up for SO personnel and courses. (HCO PL 24 Sept 70R) Gold Base:
Holds the Golden Era Productions facilities where Scientology religious training films and audio properties are produced and technical compilations occur. (‘What Is Scientology?’ (1992 edition), page 508) HCOB:
‘Hubbard Communications Office Bulletin’. Color flash–red ink on white paper. Written by LRH only , but only so starting from January 1974. These are the technical issue line. All data for auditing and courses is contained in HCOBs. For more information go here (separate window). HCO PL:
‘Hubbard Communication Office Policy Letter’. Color flash–green ink on white paper. Written by LRH only, but only so starting from January 1974. These are the organizational and administrative issue line. For more information go here (separate window). HGC:
‘Hubbard Guidance Center’. The department of the technical division of a Scientology organization which sets you up for and delivers auditing. IAS:
‘International Association of Scientologists’. A Scientology membership granting amongst other 20% discounts and other financial advantages. IMDB:
‘International Movie Database’. Internet address: https://www.imdb.com. Used as a source reference. LRH:
An usual abbreviation for ‘L. Ron Hubbard’. LRH ED:
‘L. Ron Hubbard Executive Directive’. Earlier called SEC EDs (Secretarial EDs). These are issued by LRH to various areas. They are not valid longer than one year if fully complied with when they are automatically retired. They otherwise remain valid until fully complied with or until amended or cancelled by another LRH ED. They carry current line, projects, programs, immediate orders and directions. They are numbered for area and sequence for the area and are sent to staffs or specific posts in orgs. They are blue ink on white paper with a special heading. (HCO PL 24 Sept 70R) Mimeo: Mimeograph section. The section within the Scientology organization that takes care of all the printed references, printing, storing, organizing, filing etc. Since the ’80s however the printing is not done anymore with a mimeograph machine (or ‘Roneo’), it became off-set printing. However the name Mimeo is still the name used to address this section. OCA, APA:
‘Oxford Capacity Analysis’. The OCA (Oxford Capacity Analysis) is the English version of the American Personality Analysis (APA). The OCA (or APA) consists of 200 questions. These 200 questions are divided up into series of 20 questions, each of which measures a single personality trait. Thus ten traits are measured in all. (HCO PL 3 Nov 70 II) org(s):
Short for ‘organization(s)’. OT:
Short for ‘Operating Thetan’. Denotes a person having advanced to the higher levels in Scientology. PAB:
‘Professional Auditors Bulletin’. Scientology periodical (monthly) send to all members to keep auditors informed about the latest discoveries concerning processing procedures and other. PTS, PTSness:
‘potential trouble source’. 1. Somebody who is connected with an SP (suppressive person) who is invalidating him, his beingness, his processing, his life. (SH Spec 63, 6506C08) 2. He's here, he's way up today and he's way down tomorrow. (Establishment Officer Lecture 3, 7203C02 SO I) 3. The mechanism of PTS is environmental menace that keeps something continually keyed in. This can be a constant recurring somatic or continual, recurring pressure or a mass. (HCOB 5 Dec 68) reactive mind: 1. That portion of a person's mind which works on a stimulus-response basis (given a certain stimulus, it gives a certain response) which is not under his volitional control and which exerts force and the power of command over his awareness, purposes, thoughts, body and actions. It consists of GPMs, Engrams, Secondaries and Locks. (Scientology Abridged Dictionary) 2. Stored in the reactive mind are engrams, and here we find the single source of aberrations and psychosomatic ills. (Scientology 0-8, p. 11) 3. ‘bank’: a colloquial name for the reactive mind. This is what the procedures of Scientology are devoted to disposing of, for it is only a burden to an individual and he is much better off without it. (Scientology Abridged Dictionary) 4. The reactive mind acts below the level of consciousness. It is the literal stimulus-response mind. Given a certain stimulus it gives a certain response. (The Fundamentals of Thought, p. 58) RPF:
‘Rehabilitation Project Force’. For more detailed information see article here (separate window). Sea Org (SO):
Short for ‘Sea Organization’. This is the senior organization within the Church of Scientology that see to it that Advanced Organizations (AOs) and the Class IV-V organizations do function well. They send out so-called missions if there are indications or if they find that improvement or corrections are called for. They also provide for dissemination and other programs that the Scientology organizations are to comply with. Missions may be send out to implement these and instruct the organizations. Sec Check(ing):
Short for ‘security check(ing). third dynamic:
There could be said to be eight urges (drives, impulses) in life. These we call dynamics. These are motives or motivations.
The ‘third dynamic’ is the urge towards existence in groups or individuals. Also referred to as the ‘group dynamic’. Wiki:
On this page this is short for Wikipedia. Used as a source reference.
that says donations to Scientology are not deductible because they are quid pro quo. Meaning, you get something in exchange.